Knights & Knaves Alehouse

At least now I know who to NOT buy my next module from.

I totally agree Ben. While it may have been an unintentional error on the publisher's part, truth of the matter is that there are a number of legitimate, proven producers of retro-clone gaming material that I'd much rather give my hard-earned money.

Odds are that the majority of the Insidious sales will never leave the shrink wrap.

- Wheggi

For my small press outfit, North Wind Adventures, I had 1,000 copies printed of our first adventure, Charnel Crypt of the Sightless Serpent. That was back in March, 2010. I had 5 boxes, each with 200 copies. Recently I cracked open the second box, from which I may have now sold about 25 copies. Am I going about things the wrong way? Should I have been more "controversial" or should I just plod along as I am?

Ghul wrote:Am I going about things the wrong way?

Not unless you want to be seen as a buffoon or a jerkwad..

Ghul wrote:Am I going about things the wrong way? Should I have been more "controversial" or should I just plod along as I am?

I'm sure that's what some people would think, Jeff. The wrong sort of people.

I think the mean spirited reaction here to this publication is shameful.

No-one knows what WotC think about the presentation of the module. Those who have been more careful in abiding by the legal niceties at worst need only observe the subsequent ramifications or at best will benefit too from WotC indulgence or indifference.

As someone who cares little for modules I still respect the authors audacity in the hope that in the long run AD&D might escape its shackles.

kent wrote:I think the mean spirited reaction here to this publication is shameful.

People playing with trademarks for publicity stunts with complete disregard for later consequences and possible carpet C&D bombings are the ones who should be ashamed of themselves.

Well, without knowing whether they really did it on purpose we should not be too quick to judge, even if we have our suspicions that nobody can really be that foolish in good faith. For my part, I am reserving judgement. If they turn out a line of modules with no further problems of this sort, and I hear good things about them from reliable sources (such as grodog), I might buy into the line. As things currently stand I have more than enough material for pick-up games, so I am in no rush.

Ghul wrote:For my small press outfit, North Wind Adventures, I had 1,000 copies printed of our first adventure, Charnel Crypt of the Sightless Serpent. That was back in March, 2010. I had 5 boxes, each with 200 copies. Recently I cracked open the second box, from which I may have now sold about 25 copies. Am I going about things the wrong way? Should I have been more "controversial" or should I just plod along as I am?

This seems to be more the norm. My first module, RC1 The Thing in the Valley, just reached the 200 sales mark. It has been out for about 10 months. It is still my best seller. My other modules are in 150 range.

For DCG to sell 250 copies is a great accomplishment. And to do it in about a month is huge. They did have a booth a GC (mostly selling old RPG materials) and that did generate some sales. That was well before the controversy really ramped up. But I do suspect that plastering Advanced Dungeons & Dragons on the front cover did something to help move sales. Let's face it, the name sells.

That said, I will not follow that road. The OGL is clear and I will publish along those guidelines. Will I push the envelope? Whenever I can! But the goal is to create a healthy OSR. I buy pretty much everything that comes out in print that is old school driven. And often, it sits for quite some time before I can time to read it. But supporting the OSR is important to me. So I will buy the next Die Cast product. Let's hope that the controversy is put to rest with their next release. The market will determine the eventual success of DCG. Right now, they have taken the quantum leap to the top of the heap (as far as sales are concerned). Great for them. The rest of us (small publishers) need to step up our game...that is business...and it should advance the OSR.

Odhanan wrote:At least now I know who to NOT buy my next module from.

+1

There are plenty of other people selling stuff I want who don't feel the need to stoop to such disingenuous practices to make a buck.

Chainsaw wrote:

Ghul wrote:Am I going about things the wrong way?

Not unless you want to be seen as a buffoon or a jerkwad..

What if I already got those covered?

francisca wrote:What if I already got those covered?

Just to be clear, I'm pumped about Ghul's AS&SH game, especially after reading the CAS stories recently. Should be awesome.

mhensley wrote:

Odhanan wrote:At least now I know who to NOT buy my next module from.

+1

There are plenty of other people selling stuff I want who don't feel the need to stoop to such disingenuous practices to make a buck.

Oh, come off it. What's disingenuous about it? Did you think it was a real TSR module? Did you think it was a 4e Module? Did you think it was a WotC module of any sort for any edition?

It says it's an AD&D module and it seems that it is. So who's lied to you about anything here?

If they did indeed put the OGL text in the module then they have made a major mistake; if they take it out again then they still have the issue of having Dungeons and Dragons as part of the dominant cover design. They might have a long shot at getting away with that, but I'd be surprised.

Put it out again without the OGL text and make "Insidious" the main logo and "for use with First Edition AD&D" at the bottom somewhere and Bob's your uncle.

Except that they've probably already pulled the trigger and the bullet just hasn't arrived at their head yet.

Yeah, it was dumb, but catch yourself on before getting worked up about people being disingenuous when they've just been foolish.

Nagora wrote:Yeah, it was dumb, but catch yourself on before getting worked up about people being disingenuous when they've just been foolish.

Have you looked at the thread on the Acaeum? These guys are seriously patting themselves on the back for being sold out on the product. I haven't seen a single hint of "oops I made a big mistake", but many hints of "yeah! My stunt actually worked and now I can reprint with a different layout to avoid problems!"

Have a look around for yourself. I have a really hard time to believe this was all a mistake.

I just noticed something, perhaps the ire that this is bringing has little to do with the cover. While initially true that using ADVANCED DUNGEONS DRAGONS is clearly "mongo retarded" perhaps its a subliminal message thats driving this whether its intended or not.

DIE cast games INSIDIOUS MODULE discussion

The cover may have been the "spark" but has become irrelevant. Its the heading on this thread thats perpetuating this. Its plugging right into your brain and saying somebody did something wrong before you've even made a decision.

I'm coming out with a module and the thread to discuss:

VIOLATION OF THE SACRED GAMES KILL THE LIVING VISCERA OF GRYRAX DISSECTION