Maps and Characters

[Flambeaux]

And my axe!
/ducks out of thread

That makes two of us.

[Falconer]

Scotsmen dwarves are a pet peeve of mine, too. Dwarves as such are derived from Norse Mythology via Tolkien. In SoOC, Gygax gave one a German accent, which makes slightly more sense if you’re going the “Norse Mythology” route, but I’d rather go the “via Tolkien” route and just skip the accent altogether (crappy movies notwithstanding).

I did play a kobold with a French accent in his LA game one time, and he loved it and started doing the same accent. But that’s different, I think, because it’s incongruous for comic effect. And it’s okay to play a caricature for a one-shot, but in a sustained campaign it gets old and can interfere with gameplay. In stage acting they tell you not to portray a funny character in a self-parodying fashion.

[AxeMental]

Based on Axe's description, I'm not in the "D&D as reality simultor" camp. I'm also opposed to Method Acting for the same reasons.

What do you mean by "method acting". There are three things often confused here: 1. imagining you or your piece in the setting described (but being your personality), 2. taking on the role of a different personality (ie. method acting) and 3. acting out at the table (which can be done by either 1 or 2. If done by 2 is a nightmare... If done by 1 its often just a way to get into the game, to enhance your imagination and immersion experience.

I don't see whats supposed to be notable about calling D&D a reality simulator. The DM describes a fantasy reality as the players move threw it (the way you read about a reality in a novel). You are a character in that reality moving around. How is that controversial? Maybe I'm making my point poorly?

[geneweigel]

Scotsmen dwarves are a pet peeve of mine, too. Dwarves as such are derived from Norse Mythology via Tolkien. In SoOC, Gygax gave one a German accent, which makes slightly more sense if you’re going the “Norse Mythology” route, but I’d rather go the “via Tolkien” route and just skip the accent altogether (crappy movies notwithstanding).

I did play a kobold with a French accent in his LA game one time, and he loved it and started doing the same accent. But that’s different, I think, because it’s incongruous for comic effect. And it’s okay to play a caricature for a one-shot, but in a sustained campaign it gets old and can interfere with gameplay. In stage acting they tell you not to portray a funny character in a self-parodying fashion.

Now see, YOU know when to stop. There are these people in this world who lack austerity and they just keep it trudging. Even after telling them to cool it they just KEEP ON BROGUEIN'...

[Ghul]

One thing that should be taken into account is this: Say the map is lost or destroyed due to some event in the dungeon. Fine. While I can appreciate the map being taken from the players, I can also appreciate that the players' understanding of all the twists and turns is not going to be the same as their characters' understanding. What I mean is, players sit at a table with beer/mt. dew/pretzels/pizza/beer/minis/character sheets/dice/etc. whilst their characters are actually seeing, feeling, smelling each feature of the dungeon as they pass through its halls, tunnels, chambers, etc. They might remember a certain archway, a distinct feature of the masonry, that spot in the corner thick with cobwebs or mold -- anything is possible. So, while taking the map away from the players is fine to me, I would be lenient with how the seekers find their way around, not forcing them to stumble into dangerous or even deadly areas already explored. I'm not saying make it absolute. You might have them at an intersection that is familiar, but they are somewhat disoriented; in effect I'm suggesting a combination of confusion and knowledge of the dungeon locations already explored, assuming the layout of the dungeon is complicated.

[Vlospiress]

One thing that should be taken into account is this: Say the map is lost or destroyed due to some event in the dungeon. Fine. While I can appreciate the map being taken from the players, I can also appreciate that the players' understanding of all the twists and turns is not going to be the same as their characters' understanding. What I mean is, players sit at a table with beer/mt. dew/pretzels/pizza/beer/minis/character sheets/dice/etc. whilst their characters are actually seeing, feeling, smelling each feature of the dungeon as they pass through its halls, tunnels, chambers, etc. They might remember a certain archway, a distinct feature of the masonry, that spot in the corner thick with cobwebs or mold -- anything is possible. So, while taking the map away from the players is fine to me, I would be lenient with how the seekers find their way around, not forcing them to stumble into dangerous or even deadly areas already explored. I'm not saying make it absolute. You might have them at an intersection that is familiar, but they are somewhat disoriented; in effect I'm suggesting a combination of confusion and knowledge of the dungeon locations already explored, assuming the layout of the dungeon is complicated.

That is a very good point, my memory in real life is crap, but I hope my characters memory is much better because she is actually there doing it 24/7 so some consideration has to be made for that.
My character sheet has always got notes of peoples names and clues etc, otherwise i wouldn't be able to function in game.

[ffilz]

Some thoughts from real life.

I have explored caves. Other than the times we were surveying the cave to produce a map, I have not mapped the caves I've been in. While there were times disorientation led to some delay in getting out, I have always gotten out of the cave, and I've been into some pretty complex caves. On the other hand, one of my favorite caves, I have never been able to get into the major portion of the cave without someone who knew the cave well leading. A few times I have tried to use a map of the cave to navigate in the cave, it ended up not being as useful as I might have thought it would be. I have looked at a map before going into the cave to get an idea of what the cave has to offer.

For outdoor situations, which granted are much different, I have two stories.

First, one time I was getting a ride home from a teacher. On the way, we had to drop something off at another school. We didn't want to go the long easy way around to get back on track to go to my house. I had a rough idea where the school was in relation to my house, but no specific knowledge of the neighborhood. I started giving directions. At each intersection, I would reflect for a second, and call out a left, straight, or right. In a matter of 5 or 6 turns, with no backtracking, we wound up on a main road on the other side of the schools neighborhood that I knew where it went. I've accomplished similar blind navigation other than this one, but this one really impressed my teacher.

Another time, actually on the way to a cave, I had been to once, but was in the back seat, this time I was navigator, and didn't have a map handy. At several points, based on my memory, I gave turns to take. I successfully navigated us the way that we had taken in the past, and would always take in the future. Details like particular houses or fields gave the clues as to when to turn onto a side road.

Frank

[AxeMental]

I think caves would be very difficult to map because they are constantly moving in three dimensions (up and down of the entrance) and because of lengthy distances. It seems it would be easier to mark your way out (in underwater caving you leave a rope). Its much easier to map in mostly two dimensions layed out in a logical way with straight lines. I would think.

[Chainsaw]

A friend of mine took me into a cave once upon a time. Mapping would have been very tough, especially if we were distracted in any way. We had to drop down into the cave using a rope, first of all. Moving away from the entry shaft, into the darkness, we turned the lights on. The initial area was all misshappen and we had to either squat down or bend over to walk. Moving in one direction (we could have gone in several), this area transitioned into another where we had to lie down and crawl between a few flattish slabs of rock. That took us into another oddly shaped, cramped area. The whole time the floor and ceiling are both changing depth/height. It went on like this for a a while. I have to be honest, I got the gist of it after about 30 minutes and was ready to go back up. The whole place was very cramped and felt like it was going to cave in at any moment.

In contrast, the underground areas in various campaigns that I've DM'd and played are all basically "worked" in some way, allowing people to move about more freely. I guess they're more like, well, actual dungeons that you'd imagine beneath a castle - just MUCH MUCH MUCH more elaborate. I suppose this is really one of the basic conceits of the game, right? I just really can't imagine my friend and I being loaded up with armor and supplies (not to mention faced with threats) trying to explore that cave I mentioned above. I'm really not even sure it would be possible.