OSR survey

[grodog]

LOL!

Allan.

[AxeMental]

I just go with Gygaxian or not Gygaxian. And by that I mean, pre-UA (which is where Gygax started compromising and expanding his notions into unfamiliar territory. Though I'm confident he'd have moved "back to center" in a 2E (if he'd had the time to think it through).

[robertsconley]

I think of it as Advanced Adventures and The Scribes of Sparn and Echoes from Fomalhaut and Mythmere Games and Fight On! and Kellri and Rob Conley and Guy Fullerton and Foster and PLEASE forgive me if I left you out but YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE. If it’s compatible with OD&D/AD&D and it springs from a love rather than rejection of 70s styles and it adheres basically to Mythmere’s Primer, that’s OSR. But if OSR means something else now, then I’m fine with it being just basically “stuff I like”. Personally, I’ve come to adopt (only semi-tongue-in-cheek) the string from the K&K RULES post: Old School GYGAXIAN games. OSG, baby!

Appreciate being in the list.

My view is that there is a group of hobbyists who play, promote, and publish for classic editions of D&D . I use the label OSR to refer to this group along with many others. Other folk have their own term for this group. And also there are some who refuse to come up with any term and just refer to specific publishers and groups. It all works because it not the label that matters but what people make or do that ultimately shape things.

The kaleidoscope that we see is what creative freedom looks like. When people are free to take the source material and realize their project in the form they think best. Sometimes that form is one of preservation, sometimes something completely different. Irregardless of what it is the foundation remains for others to pick up.

[AxeMental]

The problem is one of false advertising, bait and switch (at times unintentional) and the commercialism over quality aspects. Stick “old school” or 1e/Oe on the cover and you expect that type of module on the inside (something that would fit into the Style of dungeon popular in the time period the cover art and layout emulates. Some modules do meet this assumption (AA for most of it) Other publishers... not so much. Sometimes the guys that are loudest about the OSR are promoting modules that have more in common with 2e and 3e then 1e or 0e. So the idea of “old school” meaning Gygaxoan 1e and 0e is co-opted. Those online personalities are more agressive and active online. So you get the DF phamominia (“home of 1e AD&D claim) but in products. The OSR is certainly big tent. Yet it’s name OSR suggests a small tent (certainly not covering 2e or 3e light). It’s a way for some (not all) to stick out as “closer to the source” but with an edge. And as in all things, the genre can often be defined by the flood of material that overwhelms the consumer. Thats true for music, art history and the rest. So it’s not a big deal. It’s just a shame because the one really truly old school revolution product (1e/OSRIC) which outsold all others combined is not even mentioned as part of the OSR apparently. My impression is that many involved with the OSR are not fans of 70s style gaming. Yet they make there home in the classics? To me the OSR is closer to 2e in feel because that’s the vibe I get. So I don’t imclude the stuff that feels like it would fit in with original gygax d&d; for instance, Semajs AA modules I wouldn’t lump into the OSR.

[bobjester]

The OSR waters got too muddied for me. I just wanted my AD&D rules & new modules, not a shitload of retroclones that missed the mark.

But, we have OSRIC at least, but the modules are a little harder for me to find because I don't internet well.

[robertsconley]

The OSR waters got too muddied for me. I just wanted my AD&D rules & new modules, not a shitload of retroclones that missed the mark.

But, we have OSRIC at least, but the modules are a little harder for me to find because I don't internet well.

Perhaps this will help.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/browse.php ... =1&sort=2a

Given the misfilings I have it sorted by publishers.

[jgbrowning]

The OSR waters got too muddied for me. I just wanted my AD&D rules & new modules, not a shitload of retroclones that missed the mark.

But, we have OSRIC at least, but the modules are a little harder for me to find because I don't internet well.

Perhaps this will help.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/browse.php ... =1&sort=2a

Given the misfilings I have it sorted by publishers.

Oh look, the top ten hottest sellers in the OSRIC category again don't contain products using the OSRIC rules.

joe b.

[geneweigel]

The only thing wrong with the Old School Renaissance is that its filled with renaissance men... seriously, I think along the lines of content ASAP. I'm starting to think that D&D product on shelves is the new "old" meaning its antiquated Lorraine Williams deluxe box o' papers with no content over and over. The return of the game is an energy field that defies that.

[thedungeondelver]

Nice to feel appreciated!

Oh, wait, nobody seems to remember I was the only person doing the trade-dress, old-school look and feel thing back in '01 and '02, when nobody else was.

[Falconer]

YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE

BILL

Seriously, I thought about including you on my list, but I honestly don’t think of you as “part of” the OSR “movement” because you were doing it 5+ years before. Without your online presence, who knows if we would have ever massed enough momentum to do any of this.

[Kellri]

I'm with Joe on the Drivethrurpg thing.

Their algorithm has all of the intuitive charm and raw processing power of the pre-frontal cortex of a gecko. Apparently OSRIC as a ruleset gets lumped in with anything that uses the letters O, S and/or R. Probably because of a latent anarcho-communist streak inherited from my grandfather I feel inspired to write something called Fated to be a Fat Fucking Fudgepacking Neckbeard in a Floppy Purple Cardigan: the Storytelling Game with Roles for FATE. I'm guessing that title would pretty much guarantee a top 10 showing on purchases/searches for either the Fate ruleset or Storytelling games (or fudgepacking for that matter!). I'm also guessing the crew at DTRPG would subsequently but nevertheless quickly realize the benefits of a categorization schema that doesn't have an INT of 3 would be prudent.

For my part, some shit I churned out between a bong-hit and an angry Facebook ad hominem sub-reply could possibly become the most commercially successful thing I've ever wrote. It would be a bittersweet victory at best as I would also have to give 100% of the credit to The Dungeondelver. Standing on the shoulders of giants, motherfuckers!

[robertsconley]

Oh look, the top ten hottest sellers in the OSRIC category again don't contain products using the OSRIC rules.

Then complain I have in the past, Onebookshelf has periodic campaigns where they clean up the categories. But it not a regular thing. To me it clear cut that the OSRIC category should be for those products that support OSRIC directly.

I marked Blackmarsh because the list of stuff I use is part of the list of stuff found in OSRIC. But I didn't mark Scourge the Demon Wolf, Majestic Wilderlands as OSRIC as they are both related to Swords & Wizardry.

The Wilderlands stuff I recently put out is also marked as OD&D/Sword & Wizardry compatible not OSRIC because the original is based on OD&D not AD&D and when I do include new rules stuff I base it on Swords & Wizardry as the closest legal alternative to OD&D + Supplement that the originals used.

[rogatny]

Bag on DriveThru’s search algorithm all you want, it’s way better than Lulu’s in that it exists.

Nothing drives home the point that Lulu is a service for the author and not the consumer more than attempting to buy anything from Lulu.

[robertsconley]

I'm with Joe on the Drivethrurpg thing.

Their algorithm has all of the intuitive charm and raw processing power of the pre-frontal cortex of a gecko. Apparently OSRIC as a ruleset gets lumped in with anything that uses the letters O, S and/or R.

It not an algorithm it is the publisher not taking the time to properly categorize their work. People tend to check everything fucking thing on the list up to the maximum.

From time to time Onebookshelf will include in their newsletter a warning to publisher to clean up their catagories and take actions (by doing the re-catagorization themselves). The last one occurred I believe before the introduction of the OSR Category.

So complain to OBS. Looking it over myself it quite back. I am all for more people to join the OSR party but I feel you got to be honest about you are writing for. It not rocket science.

[jgbrowning]

Oh look, the top ten hottest sellers in the OSRIC category again don't contain products using the OSRIC rules.

Then complain I have in the past, Onebookshelf has periodic campaigns where they clean up the categories. But it not a regular thing. To me it clear cut that the OSRIC category should be for those products that support OSRIC directly.

I have, in May of this year. They requested a list of non-compliant products. I provided them 14 out of the top 20 products at the time. They then said they'd have to review them on a 1 by 1 basis.

The current #1, #2, #5, and I-don't-know-how-many-else-I-don't-care-to-check-more-than-that was on my list back in May.

With a cursory look through the list now at drivethru, it looks like the top 30 products in the OSRIC category are all not OSRIC products. (Edit: with a closer look, it looks like 3 of the top 30 products actually use OSRIC)

They're rendering the category useless.

joe b.