Extra-spells Wisdom Druids

[Benoist]

Per AD&D PH, by the book, do druids get extra-spells from Wisdom?

[Falconer]

Not spelled out in the PHB, but see the errata in TD #35, and check out the Druid in T1 (he has bonus spells for high wisdom).

[Blackadder23]

I don't see why they wouldn't. I'm personally of the opinion that sub-classes have all the advantages of the parent class unless the rules explicitly state otherwise. In any case, I allow it IMC.

[Benoist]

AHHH Jaroo. Should have thought about him! Good point!

[grodog]

Not spelled out in the PHB, but see the errata in TD #35,

Also available @ http://www.acaeum.com/library/errata_phb.html

[ScottyG]

In a Dragon article about customizing clerics, Gary mentions giving druids bonus spells as an option, as if it is not the default rule.

[Falconer]

It was never incorporated into later printings of the PHB, but if anything, the later article by Gary shows he still personally thought it was a good idea.

[vikingv]

I don't see why they wouldn't. I'm personally of the opinion that sub-classes have all the advantages of the parent class unless the rules explicitly state otherwise. In any case, I allow it IMC.

My viewpoint as well.

[Benoist]

Yeah that was my feeling as well, plus the table on Wisdom says that extra spells apply to clerics, while the first line of the druid class description points out they are a sub-class of clerics, and all the tables of the druid clearly indicate "DRUID (CLERIC)".

Was clear to me, but I wanted to know if I had missed something obvious.

[BlackBat242]

Exactly. I started playing AD&D in December 1982, in several different parts of the country (and in a military base in Japan), with college students and military personnel - and the first time I heard anyone even suggest that druids might not get the bonus spells for high wisdom was after I joined Dragonsfoot and here in the mid-2000s!

It was self-evident to everyone I gamed with that they did get the bonus spells BTB.

[Falconer]

I also give the bonus spells to Paladins (Cleric spells), Rangers (Druid spells), and Bards (Druid spells) with high Wisdom (what are the odds of that, anyway?). Not sure if that could be at all considered BTB, but it seems reasonable to me. *shrug*

[T. Foster]

I never gave bonus spells to Paladins, Rangers, or Bards. I think I may have gotten the idea from Dragon Sage Advice, so take with an appropriately-sized grain of salt. Always gave it to Druids, though, even before seeing the official errata. It always seemed self-evident and obvious, just like I always gave the Fighter sub-classes exceptional strength and gave high-Dex assassins and monks bonuses to their thieving skills. Folks who suggest otherwise are, IMO, being deliberately obtuse.

[Matthew]

I would give the bonus spells to druids, paladins, rangers and bards. Seems only fair to me and is "BtB" for the first case if not the others.

[Benoist]

I wouldn't give bonus spells to paladins and rangers, since they are sub-classes of fighters, not clerics, and the Wisdom table clearly (to me) indicates these bonus spells are for clerics.

The bard is a weirder case. Would depend on the manner in which the class is construed in the campaign, i.e. its affiliation or not to druid orders in the world, especially since the class progression before becoming bard ends with druid, which is in fact the bard taking on "clerical studies as druids" (sic).

That said, if I had to decide BTB for bards, I'd have to say "No" because it is not explicitly stated that Bards would be a sub-class of druids. The way the Notes regarding the Bards Table I is worded re: number of spells by Druid Spell Level seems to confirm that, since the bard in essence gains "druid abilities" while not being a druid himself. It doesn't say "as a druid" or equivalent.

[genghisdon]

Druids don't need them, look at their spell progression. I'm not being obtuse about it

It makes them far too potent a spell chucker at low levels. L3 druid with 17 wisdom casts 5/4/2. That is leagues beyond any other class.

It's actually an advantage NOT needing high WIS for those L6 & 7 spells BTW (which they get far sooner than a cleric)

It is correct the errata said they did use the wisdom chart, but that was a bad call, something Gygax seems to have done consistently when working with someone else's class designs.

As to paladins, they don't get wisdom effects, but they probably should, as Matthew suggests. Rangers & Bards, using druid spells, shouldn't IMHO