Dead PCs belongings, is it "treasure"?

[AxeMental]

Do the 1E rules mention if magic and other belongings taken off dead PCs or NPCs can be added to the total XPs of the PCs? For instance, tonight the party I ran cleared half of U2's lizard man dungeon, with about half the group toast. from the bodies of the dead, the group recovered +1 plate, and two +1 magical swords (which they want to sell the magic and use it to help advance in level). I'm inclined to say yes and give them normal XPs, as it was earned in "adventure". Ditto for EXPs for "taking ownership" of fallen comrads magic. Whats your BtB understanding of this?

[TRP]

AFAIK, the DMG is silent on that. At least, I don't recall the DMG addressing this.

[darnizhaan]

I would say no. The party didn't conquer anyone or anything to get the items. I wouldn't give xp reward for it, but they could sell it. I wouldn't give xp for the sold gp value, either though. Just my opinion.

[ScottyG]

I would say no. The party didn't conquer anyone or anything to get the items. I wouldn't give xp reward for it, but they could sell it. I wouldn't give xp for the sold gp value, either though. Just my opinion.

Ditto.

[TRP]

What's the best way to piss off your dead friend's* clan? Sell off his possessions.


* although, in such a game, frenemy might be a better choice of word.

[T. Foster]

is this a real question? The only way I can even possibly see this happening is an evil-aligned PC deliberately killing the other PCs for their loot (basically treating the other PCs as monsters). If you give an XP award to a PC who recovers a magic item off his dead companion (who, presumably, already got an XP award for that item when he found it) then would you do the same thing if that PC was still alive and gave the item to his companion? If so, what's to stop all of the PCs from just trading their items back and forth until everybody is level 1 million? If not, why not? Because the former owner in the first example is dead? What happens if he gets resurrected? This isn't stated explicitly in the rules because it was surely considered so obvious as to go without saying.

[AxeMental]

Well, there's a big difference between trading magic back and forth (clearly against the intent of the game), and a group going on a deadly adventure, where 10 PCs get whittled down to 3 after long brutal battles (and alot of experience is had). Its not as cut and dry as finding a +1 ring in a dragons treasure pile (clearly XPs gained), but if a NPC MU got toasted and his companions found that ring on his cooked fingers (perhaps not even knowing about it), and threw it in the treasure pile, one could argue they "earned it" threw the experience of battle and killing the dragon that did the MU in. I can see both sides, thats why I asked. So yes, a serious question. Plus last night was a particularly cheap skate dungeon and they wanted to know.

[THACZero]

For killing another PC, yes, but for other reasons I'd say no. Imagine a PC has his magic ring stolen, then has to adventure aqnd evade threats to get it back. Does he gain the XP again as for a new magic ring? I don't think there is a clear adjucation, but I'd just say 'no' and leave it at that.

[Blackadder23]

I don't think this is really covered by an explicit rule, but I don't give XP for killing other PCs or for looting their bodies. Killing another PC is like scoring a touchdown for the wrong team, and you don't get points for that. As far as treasure goes, the party as a whole only gets XP one time per item. If one PC already received XP for an item, that's it. Go find some more treasure!

[AxeMental]

I don't think this is really covered by an explicit rule, but I don't give XP for killing other PCs or for looting their bodies. Killing another PC is like scoring a touchdown for the wrong team, and you don't get points for that. As far as treasure goes, the party as a whole only gets XP one time per item. If one PC already received XP for an item, that's it. Go find some more treasure!

Maybe the reason I even consider this, is that I don't see 1E AD&D as side A vs. side B, I see it as your PC (who happens to be on side A) vs. side B. When the chips are down its ultimately you (not just your team) thats trying to survive (you see this when its every man for himself situations, particularly for evil PCs). Another way to think of it, if the dragon kills the MU with the +1 ring the dragon is the new "temporary owner", if you kill the dragon afterwards (even seconds) your the new owner(s). This is similar logic to what we see when Harry Potter becomes the rightful owner of the Elder Wand (in a somewhat convoluted manner) in the Harry Potter series. I agree with you guys though, the XPs for any particular item that the group found on a previous adventure has already going to give out all the XPs its going to give them. I'm limiting this to new magic brought in by NPCs that join the group and get killed (and then you defeat the monster that did it).

Remember too, per the early modules, NPCs are always potentially dangerous...in Foster lingo, potential "monsters" (think B2 or Homlette NPC's). Many of you simply don't play that way, where everyone that joins the team is faithful (which is a mistake I think, how often is that the case in real life?).

Plus, its not XPs for X treasure for beating a Ymonster or a Z trap, it simply has to be any treasure found in the course of the adventure (from the point you leave the tavern to the point you get back). I'd certainly include a +1 ring worn by an assassin pretending to be a ranger (payed to kill the party) but who got killed before he could perform his task by a random encounter (say a lion on the way to the dungeon). Espl. if the party discovered he was an assassin from his belongings (disguise kit, vile of poison, etc.).

There is very little cut and dry in 1E it seems.

[Terrex]

Like I said in the other similar XP post, I only assign XP for a magical item once. Members of the party can pass the item around, gift it, and bequest it all they want. But, only the character first laying claim to it gets the one-time full XP reward. The only exception is if a character loses possession somehow and that character (or another character) reclaim it. In that case I would assign XP
to the character re-possessing it.

While handling this type of thing is not necessarily covered BTB, by my reading of the DMG, the above is closest to the spirit of the rule. I find it easy to rule this way as magical items with significant XP values, usually come with significant benefits to the character using the item. If an M-U grabs a staff of power off his dead comrade's body, he doesn't get XP, but he's still not complaining...

[Chainsaw]

No XP for looting a fallen buddy's corpse. We have had many PC deaths, run it this way and never has any player pushed back. Also, we already divide XP from loot equally upon discovery (regardless of who gets what items).

[Juju EyeBall]

I'd consider it double-dipping. The reward is just recovering it.

[AxeMental]

No XP for looting a fallen buddy's corpse. We have had many PC deaths, run it this way and never has any player pushed back. Also, we already divide XP from loot equally upon discovery (regardless of who gets what items).

Agreed, but what about in the case of a NPC joining the group (so new magic, and obvously no double dipping)?

Thats really the source of the question. I ran U2 last night, and to beef the party up they took along a couple NPCs (which I grabbed from the roster in the back of the module).
One had +1 plate another +1 longsword. Both were killed in battle. The party having found something like 300 GPs wanted to know if they sold the plate and longsword could they get the XPs as if it were treasure. I'm not a fan of looting bodies, but then again, they killed the monsters that killed the previous owner, so a transferal of XPs in a way.

Also, what about in the case where its an assassin or evil cleric (ala B2) who dies before he gets the chance to take out the group, and happens to have on some magic?

[Chainsaw]

No XP for looting a fallen buddy's corpse. We have had many PC deaths, run it this way and never has any player pushed back. Also, we already divide XP from loot equally upon discovery (regardless of who gets what items).

Agreed, but what about in the case of a NPC joining the group (so new magic, and obvously no double dipping)? Thats really the source of the question.

Yeah, I guess I would in that case. I mean, the only difference in looting an old skeleton at the bottom of a pit trap and and NPC who joined you in town before falling into a pit trap is that the latter had a little more air time, eh? /shrug