Knights & Knaves Alehouse

I have never played or ran OD&D. Nor do I own it. I started playing with Holmes Basic. I would like to try it. So, what OD&D retro-clone would you suggest to me?

I'd suggest going onto BitTorrent or some such place and downloading a copy of the real thing. If you're unable or unwilling to do that I've heard mostly good things about S&W White Box.

Depends on how much a purist you are.

As suggested above, it's possible to get pdfs of the original books, and it's easy to print them off.

S&W does a good job of getting down the basic mechanics of the original game into a cohesive form. OTOH, it does add things that did not appear in the OD&D game... ascending AC for example. In the end, S&W is less of a clone and more of a restatement of the original game.

Semaj Khan wrote:S&W does a good job of getting down the basic mechanics of the original game into a cohesive form. OTOH, it does add things that did not appear in the OD&D game... ascending AC for example.

And does not include some parts of the original material (I'm thinking volume 3 bits and pieces here, the text and methodology itself, etc.).

Semaj Khan wrote:In the end, S&W is less of a clone and more of a restatement of the original game.

I agree. S&W is its own game, but it's the closest you can get from the real deal without getting the original LBBs themselves (which I would advise, with a copy of the Chainmail rules).

I am somewhat hesitant to download the original OD&D material since I don't own it myself. I mean I have a ton of files and such, but I also own the hardcopies to everything I have.

Semaj Khan wrote:Depends on how much a purist you are.

As suggested above, it's possible to get pdfs of the original books, and it's easy to print them off.

S&W does a good job of getting down the basic mechanics of the original game into a cohesive form. OTOH, it does add things that did not appear in the OD&D game... ascending AC for example. In the end, S&W is less of a clone and more of a restatement of the original game.

I'm not much a purist. I use to play 3e, but after playing (3e) for years, I longed for the simplicity AD&D.

I've personally found that Labyrinth Lord + the Original Edition Characters supplement is a pretty good substitute for OD&D. That's what my players use since they don't own the LBBs. LL + OEC has nearly all the features of the original game and doesn't, so far as I've noticed, add anything to the rules you can't find in the 1974 books. So, there's no ascending AC, unified saves, etc. It's not perfect (OEC uses variable HD types and includes several spells not found in OD&D), but it's close enough that I've encountered no significant incompatibilities between it and the LBBs I use at my table.

I really like Swords and Wizardry Whitebox myself but I'm a very experienced DM. I like having the bare framework to build on but a less experienced DM and players may find the lack of exploration rules a serious short-coming.

Epees & Sorcerellerie really captures the spirit of OD&D for me but it strays into wider rules variations/deviations at the same time and while it sets the ground for magical items it's sensible do it yourself notes still leave the harried DM short.

Platemail looks fun it offers a different take on a chainmail-esque D&D. It's more of a re-imagining than say a clone so it can't get best OD&D clone pick.

So three fun options I' like the looks of but no true "best" OD&D clone by my own reckoning.

I've had OEC for LL for sometime but haven't really given it much attention for a while.

Up until when Gary passed away, you could get an OD&D set for about what a set of brand new 3.5 books would cost you on a per-book basis. That's $75-$100, depending on who you bought them from; also by "set" I mean Dungeon Masters Guide, Players Handbook and Monster Manual.

Essentially the original D&D RPG cost about what the current D&D RPG cost!

thedungeondelver wrote:Up until when Gary passed away, you could get an OD&D set for about what a set of brand new 3.5 books would cost you on a per-book basis. That's $75-$100, depending on who you bought them from; also by "set" I mean Dungeon Masters Guide, Players Handbook and Monster Manual.

Essentially the original D&D RPG cost about what the current D&D RPG cost!

I wish I would have picked up a copy when I had the chance. They are too damn expensive for me now.

Clangador wrote:

thedungeondelver wrote:Up until when Gary passed away, you could get an OD&D set for about what a set of brand new 3.5 books would cost you on a per-book basis. That's $75-$100, depending on who you bought them from; also by "set" I mean Dungeon Masters Guide, Players Handbook and Monster Manual.

Essentially the original D&D RPG cost about what the current D&D RPG cost!

I wish I would have picked up a copy when I had the chance. They are too damn expensive for me now.

My first set (which was Vol. 1 & 3 with a copy of Moldvay Basic substituting for Vol 2 and a copy of Greyhawk) was free; someone bought them at a library sale and gave them to me. I tracked down a Vol II for like $25, then a Supplement I, III etc. over time. I picked up a handful of Chainmail copies for $10 each at a wargaming convention - all of them still shrinkwrapped (I had four; I gave one away to the fellows running the Ziggurat gaming convention in the Green Zone in Iraq), then bought an unwrapped one online.

Then one day I decided it'd be nice to have a copy for keeping as well as a play copy so I bought it for $95 on addall.com, but the owner took $10 off for a tear in one corner of the box.

You can get all three books, loose, at NobleKnight for $155.

On the next page, supplements I-III will set you back another $110. I don't know why G,DG&H is so expensive there. I think mine was like $40. There's swords & Spells for $17, though.

That’s why I linked to that 6th printing box for $130 BIN. That’s a pretty good deal, these days. It got snagged right away. Did one of you snag it?

A few years ago (before Gary died), I got an excellent 5th printing for $100, PLUS the first five AD&D hardcovers, a Moldvay Basic box, a Holmes Basic box, and geomorphs (cut out) thrown in.

I also got a shrinkwrapped Chainm Ail for $13.

Ahh, pre-OSR, those were the days!

I think I paid something like $60 for my copy of the OCE set, sold it for, I dunno $75 at some point. Later, I picked up chainmail and OD&D, and a couple of the supplements when they were legal at RPGNow. I'm glad I did, as they are interesting to peruse, but I doubt I'll ever actually play OD&D outside of GaryCon, and just can't see spending the money to have a set of book at hand (which I wouldn't need to reference in-game anyhow.)

I'm with James on this one. LL+OEC is damn close, but you have two books to thumb through, etc... S&W has that beat in regards to having it in one volume, but is sort of one-stepped removed with the ascending AC and single save, IMO.

FYI, the latest edition of S&W:WB (and possibly also the other versions of S&W?) offer multiple save categories, and IIRC some other “optional rules” to bring it more in line with true OD&D.