Knights & Knaves Alehouse

TheRedPriest wrote:From a book reading perspective, [Alice] would totally suck ass.

Probably so. The main reason I liked Fighting Fantasy (and Lone Wolf) was that it was still a "game" rather than an "interactive book." You had the fun of flipping madly through pages, closing your eyes and slamming your finger down on a grid of random numbers, and keeping track of your health and inventory. Oh, and you could die.

Random wrote:Nuts. This is what books are supposed to look like.
As a book reader and collector, I'm going to spend the next 50-60 years of my life hating these kinds of gadgets.

I'm right there with you, Random, but when I was given a Kindle by my company for my 10 years of wage labor, I found that I rather liked it. Not that I'd buy a book on a Kindle instead of a real book, but I did load up on Project Gutenberg books to take on a trip to Europe this summer, and it was great

Similarly, I can't imagine ever giving up real physical dice rolling, pencils, graph paper, character sheets, DM screens, books, minis, and such for the new Ideo book ideas. I do, however, see a lot of possibility in them as travel references/tools, more-immersive CYOA books, and perhaps as a way that could be much more preferable for discussing RPGs than a vanilla web browser interface: being able to pull rules quotes from within the same window vs. having to find my DMG .pdf, load it up, select the text to quote, cut and paste it, and fix the formatting before I can actually then finish a post with my own comments/interpretations is, well, vexing sometimes (especially when the web browser refreshes due to some stray mouse click or key combo, and I lose 15 minutes of research and writing).

My wife has one of those readers, although not specifically a Kindle. I have used it in the past to read Google scans of classics, but I couldn't see myself paying for digital copies of novels. It might be more appropriate for throw-away literature (e.g. romance novels).

I have a Sony Reader, its slightly annoying after a while because it seems to take longer to read a full page and theres no flipping around to "consult the appendix or map" which kills a lot of "old faves". However, if its straight ahead reading with no prodding around then its great and convenient for places that put you in a mood to read something more appropriate to the mood and ZAP you have it. Thats the real thrill of it. Of course, reading from a hard book with pages seems more slicker almost like typing words on a new keyboard in the dark it takes a while to overcome the loss of peripheral vision before your subconscious can handle it automatically. Its the same here your mind wants to slap the page over and you've got a half second pause that starts to annoy.

Also, I am deeply disturbed that the "bookmark" feature of my wife's (Sony) reader takes the form of "dog-earing" the digital pages.

I have told my wife that she should avoid at all costs doing that to any of my books, as I don't know if I could emotionally handle it. I am visibly upset when I witness anyone dog-earing a page of anything but the most disposable paperbacks.

You might suggest I need therapy, but better yet people can just be careful while handling my books. Heck, I make a big deal out of yawning while reading my books. Sometimes people involunarily shoot a mist of spit while yawning, and I don't want spitmist on my pages.

I like books to rot for some reason. It lends a sense of time passing plus I had my PHB and DMG stolen in 1987 which kind of cut the ropes on holding them as precious. Sort of adopted the yeah just get another one in that regard. Although I haven't been able to replace my Trampier DM screen that my uncle gave me in 1982 and its getting real ugly lately. I think its the only thing I've used consistently except in 1983 or 1984 I had used the second GAMMA WORLD SCREEN for the GW campaign otherwise I just would prop the Tramp one up for everything. (I had bought a blue Cthulhu screen (I forget which year[late 80's?]) and I regretted it because it didn't make it any better! ) So that thing is remarkably used but if I get a new one then I'm still using the old one for cover.

I'm not interested in any artifacts that kill gaming as a social event. You can sign me the heck up for any cool little gizmos that assist my DMing or enhance gaming at the table, but forget anything that attempts to give me a solitaire experience.

With the computer age we have been forced to give up many of our senses (smell, touch...) as they relate to certain things (like books, playing games drawing etc.) thus reducing our connection to them. Some of those things I hated as a kid and young adult I now miss.
I used to hate the smell of the library stacks back at a college. Last I heard they cleared out the libraries and turned those old musty floors into offices. Apparently, online books are the "substitute". But they don't compare to being able to flip threw a dozen books in minutes, or the ideas one generates seeing unrelated topics in the search and going in new directions you'd otherwise miss.

New research shows taking notes by hand is far superior to typing them on laptops (because of how it hard wires in to our brains). I suspect the computer age will turn out to be one of the things that reduced rather then enhanced the human experience. That "table top" experience we so love with 1E and other games relates to that involvement of all the senses (computer RPGing can be fun but is no substitute IMO).

The big cheese to reach for would be video linking for games that would be interesting. Frankly, i don't even have a computer cam but I can imagine its possible. These con things are so disappointing to find out that it wasn't what you thought it was going to be because you expect a certain type of player and it turns out you get hooked up with a lot of aggressive people who are just that: aggressive but not necessarily on the same page. I've gone to things and its like it starts off well and then next thing you know the person you thought was okay shifts gears and has this mentality of that now that the formalities over ("Yes, I love this and that", etc) and slowly eases you into a big lukewarm tub of off the shelf "Williams' age mediocrity" as the game.

I have no desire to play an rpg either by myself or over a computer screen, but it would be very nice to have a computer take care of all the record-keeping and to have the entire adventure (including maps, visual aids, stats, hotlinks to relevant sections of the rules, etc.) and rules on a single portable device, to be able to show up to a game with just an iPad in hand rather than a stack of a half-dozen hardbound books, a couple notebooks or binders, a bag of dice, and (for some people, not me) a rolled up battlemat, set of dry-erase markers, and a couple boxes of minis. The former facilitates casual and spur-of-the-moment play (the way a lot of us used to get in a half-hour of play during lunch or recess at school), the latter does the opposite.

if all the players have their own devices networked to the GM's then the possibilities become even greater -- the computer does all the record-keeping (hit points, spells, ammo, encumbrance, etc.) and random number generating for the players as well as the GM, can provide customized "battlemat" views for each player showing what his character can see and where he is in relation to everyone else, the GM and other players can send private notes on the sly, and when the game gets boring you can websurf or check Facebook without being so obvious about it

These kinds of tools would make running (and playing in) the game a lot easier and would (IMO) enrich rather than diminish the experience. Sure most people would probably use these tools to play via Skype or whatever, but you can just as easily use it for completely traditional 6-dudes-sitting-around-a-table-in-the-basement face to face play, the only difference being that instead of everyone having big stacks of books, papers, dice, and minis, everything everyone needs is on their mobile device -- which means more room at the table for drinks and snacks

Foster: "to be able to show up to a game with just an iPad in hand rather than a stack of a half-dozen hardbound books, a couple notebooks or binders..."

Wow, not me. I hate that idea. That stuff is half the fun. I'm starting to feel like Kirks Attorney (the one who loves actual books) on whatever episode that was. Seriously, what about the pictures, the old stains the tactile connection with the past, that feel of frequently referenced pages. You are definitely a hipster compared to me Trent. An Ipad, really.

What I would like to use computers for would be a huge interconnected D&D game with millions of players. Kinda like WoWC but with actual talking, cool hand painted graphics scanned in instead of the digital stuff. Where one uses their imagination. Hell, even just games with 1 DM and say 30 players it could be cool (with the stuff Foster is suggesting, each player communicating stuff to the DM and each other while at the table).

Yeah, that's all well and good Foster, but I'm not tossing my several hundred dollar IPad at any annoying players. I suppose a ping attack could be an adequate substitute.

I probably lean with Axe and TRP at this point, but if I saw Foster make it work, I might be on board, especially if it facilitated getting new players or having more games. I'd always keep my books though..

TheRedPriest wrote:Yeah, that's all well and good Foster, but I'm not tossing my several hundred dollar IPad at any annoying players. I suppose a ping attack could be an adequate substitute.

Whereas I was thinking about how much easier it is to wipe pizza and cheeto grease off the screen of your mobile device than off your OD&D booklets that would cost as much or more to replace

I don't know I'm addicted to my dry erase magnetic grid board for a long time now. Thats definitely "neo". Last game I used the laptop but I was just playing video clips from THE HOBBIT for laughs (In particular, the voice of Mr Slate as Bard over and over which I kept mimicking "Flintstone, you've never failed me before..." ). Everything else charts and such were on paper I even printed up the maps that I polished in a program because sometimes having polished maps even just for me make it seem more easy to talk about.