What are you reading?

[JCBoney]

A Study of History by Arnold J. Toynbee.

[grodog]

Before bed, I've been reading Beyond the Deep: The Deadly Descent into the World's Most Treacherous Cave by William Stone and Barbara am Ende (which was a Christmas gift from Heather and the boys).

It's good thus far, but we haven't gotten into the meat of their journey into the Sistema Huautla yet, which should be pretty interesting to read.

Last year in 2nd grade, Henry did a state report on Tennessee, which included some research (of his choosing) into the Craighead Caverns, which contains The Lost Sea---an underground lake which is apparently the largest underwater body in the USA and the 2nd largest is the world!: http://thelostsea.com/

We've talked about doing a family trip there sometime over a summer. We'll see if the new book makes more or less interested in such an excursion

[Stonegiant]

Before bed, I've been reading Beyond the Deep: The Deadly Descent into the World's Most Treacherous Cave by William Stone and Barbara am Ende (which was a Christmas gift from Heather and the boys).

It's good thus far, but we haven't gotten into the meat of their journey into the Sistema Huautla yet, which should be pretty interesting to read.

Last year in 2nd grade, Henry did a state report on Tennessee, which included some research (of his choosing) into the Craighead Caverns, which contains The Lost Sea---an underground lake which is apparently the largest underwater body in the USA and the 2nd largest is the world!: http://thelostsea.com/

We've talked about doing a family trip there sometime over a summer. We'll see if the new book makes more or less interested in such an excursion

Always have wanted to go see the lost sea.

[artikid]

Began reading the first Dumarest book.

[TRP]

Always have wanted to go see the lost sea.

Sorry to be a buzzkill, but it's not all that. We went when I 12 or 13, and I thought it was awesome. I revisited it a couple of years ago, and it wasn't very interesting. Mostly, it was way smaller than I recalled, and the boat ride was pretty dull. The caverns themselves are also fairly milquetoast too. Although, the caverns are very wide and high, and that's interesting.

[grodog]

Good to know, thanks TRP! Have you (or anyone else) also been to Mammoth Cave, and if so, how do they compare?

[Kellri]

Began reading the first Dumarest book.

Earlier last year I went on a Dumarest spree and read them all. They're not heavy, so you can read one in a day or two. I liked some more than others, but overall I enjoyed the series so much that I've incorporated a lot of Dumarest stuff into my long-running Traveller solo game.

One thing I really liked is that there is no galaxy-spanning Imperium. There are a couple of organizations, like the Cyclan, the Hausi, and the Church of Universal Brotherhood that do cover most of the setting, but they are hardly galactic governments. There are a number of small-ish 3-4 planet groups but these don't appear to be very powerful and mostly made up of a single planet and a couple of subject planets.

Some differences that would need to be considered for a Dumarest Traveller campaign -

- There doesn't seem to be ANY starship combat or interstellar combat at all. There are a lot of mercenary companies, but these are standard planetary military forces which travel to a particular planet and wage war there, but not in space.
- Interstellar travel in the Dumarest-verse apparently takes a long time, relatively speaking. This time problem is solved by the use of drugs onboard that slow the metabolism to a crawl so the traveller only perceives a rather short timespan. Dumarest himself could be centuries old because of frequent interstellar travel, and is not in-fact really sure himself just how much real time has passed since he began travelling. One unwritten side-effect of this would mean that returning to a place after a number of starship journeys could possibly mean decades or even centuries had passed.
- In the novels, many of the planets Dumarest visits could be considered to have stagnant or backward cultures. It's quite possible for one planet to be medieval while the next on par with the Earth's 20th century. Generally however, there aren't a whole lot of really high tech places.
- Computers and interstellar communications appear to be relatively rare, and often controlled by special interests. The Church used radios while the Cyclan communicate via telepathic meditation. Starships have radios, but it is stated more than once that unless someone is specifically trying to receive a signal, such communication is like shouting into a void. Breaking down in the middle of space is a big problem, as the chances of a timely rescue is extremely slim.

Anyways...because I'm obsessive/compulsive, I compiled a Dumarest Encyclopedia of terms, people, places, etc. while I was reading. I'm not sure if it's useful to anyone, but I'd be interested in putting it into some kind of RPG format (perhaps for Stars Without Number or the Cepheus Engine).

[artikid]

Began reading the first Dumarest book.

Earlier last year I went on a Dumarest spree and read them all. They're not heavy, so you can read one in a day or two. I liked some more than others, but overall I enjoyed the series so much that I've incorporated a lot of Dumarest stuff into my long-running Traveller solo game.

Agreed, it really makes you itch for a game of Traveller

[grodog]

Began reading the first Dumarest book.

Earlier last year I went on a Dumarest spree and read them all. They're not heavy, so you can read one in a day or two. I liked some more than others, but overall I enjoyed the series so much that I've incorporated a lot of Dumarest stuff into my long-running Traveller solo game.

One thing I really liked is that there is no galaxy-spanning Imperium. There are a couple of organizations, like the Cyclan, the Hausi, and the Church of Universal Brotherhood that do cover most of the setting, but they are hardly galactic governments. There are a number of small-ish 3-4 planet groups but these don't appear to be very powerful and mostly made up of a single planet and a couple of subject planets.

Scot: have you read James H. Schmitz's The Hub and/or Vega Confederacy space opera stories? They have a similar feel, and evoke the Star Trek universe decades ahead of its inception, to me, and there are a bunch of free stories available online:

- http://www.freesfonline.de/authors/Jame ... hmitz.html
- http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/author/24957

While the freebie short stories are nice, the Baen reprints from the early '00s collect all of his fiction and novels in one place, and provide some useful introductory essays, etc., too:

- The Baen Free Library offers all of the Schmitz Baen reprints available for free download; the first book, Trigger & Friends, is @ http://baencd.freedoors.org/Books/Trigg ... /index.htm
- There was a nice guide to using the BFL (since it's web page interface was non-intuitive at best) @ http://web.allensmith.net/SciFi/Schmitz ... reated.htm but that page is corrupt now (and it's not on the internet archive). I've pinged the author to see if he can fix the page, and will report back if he does.

edit 1: it's possible that they pulled most of the free titles; I did find the full Schmitz Baen catalog is @ http://www.baen.com/catalog/category/vi ... z/id/1899/ but those links aren't free

edit 2: found this archived link that details more about the characters, serieses, etc.: http://web.archive.org/web/200803060054 ... /index.htm

[T. Foster]

My main memory of the Dumarest series is that I was personally given shit by Harlan Ellison for buying them. It was at a SF/Fantasy specialty bookstore in the Sherman Oaks, sometime around the turn of the century. He'd possibly done a reading/signing a few hours earlier but at the time I was there was just sitting around ranting to whoever would listen. I was browsing and spotted a set of 6 or so Dumarest books in the used bin and when I went to the counter to buy them he, of course, lit into my choice of reading material until the cashier defused the tension with a joke or two about whether Dumarest ever actually made it to earth or not. Not wanting to get into it with him I just said something like "yeah, I like the heavy stuff" and left with my purchase. Unsurprisingly, that store went out of business a few months later.

[ThirstyStirge]

My main memory of the Dumarest series is that I was personally given shit by Harlan Ellison for buying them. It was at a SF/Fantasy specialty bookstore in the Sherman Oaks, sometime around the turn of the century. He'd possibly done a reading/signing a few hours earlier but at the time I was there was just sitting around ranting to whoever would listen. I was browsing and spotted a set of 6 or so Dumarest books in the used bin and when I went to the counter to buy them he, of course, lit into my choice of reading material until the cashier defused the tension with a joke or two about whether Dumarest ever actually made it to earth or not. Not wanting to get into it with him I just said something like "yeah, I like the heavy stuff" and left with my purchase. Unsurprisingly, that store went out of business a few months later.

Every story I've ever heard of Ellison is that he has a talent for flying up people's noses.

I may be in the shunned minority, but I love Tubb's writing. I've gotten about 1/2 way through the Dumarest books and love mining them for ideas for my SF RPGs.

[grodog]

Every story I've ever heard of Ellison is that he has a talent for flying up people's noses.

He's a dick, pure and simple.

[Kellri]

Yeah, Harlan Ellison really loves comic books. So, for him to give you shit about reading E.C. Tubb is just some high level hypocrisy. Granted, Dumarest is not high literature or anything, but it doesn't aspire to be either. Tubb basically wrote those novels on order from his publisher and only stopped writing them when the publisher quit asking for them. I could say pretty much the same thing about 90% of my professional writing in Vietnam. That's not to say that I don't try my best, but I seriously doubt I will be churning out another IELTS preparatory manual without the cash in hand. Real likfe kind of does that to someone.

Anyways, I just finished David Gemmel's Legend, the first of his Drenai novels. It was ok. That said, there was a whole lot of skipping past the philosophical monologues about war and a whole lot of 'Holy shit, he just wrote a slightly fantasized novel about the failed Mongol invasion of Europe with no irony whatsoever" - and presumably he continued to keep writing fantasy versions of historical novels for the rest of his life. I guess it worked for him - kind of like E.C. Tubb and Dumarest.

[Welleran]

Anyways, I just finished David Gemmel's Legend, the first of his Drenai novels. It was ok. That said, there was a whole lot of skipping past the philosophical monologues about war and a whole lot of 'Holy shit, he just wrote a slightly fantasized novel about the failed Mongol invasion of Europe with no irony whatsoever" - and presumably he continued to keep writing fantasy versions of historical novels for the rest of his life. I guess it worked for him - kind of like E.C. Tubb and Dumarest.

I read that book in high school, long ago. I really liked it. Maybe it's not high falutin literature, but it is entertaining and good fodder for D&D ideas.

And I agree, Ellison is a douchenozzle.

[Kellri]

And I agree, Ellison is a douchenozzle.

Don't get me wrong. I like Harlan. He's certainly got real strong opinions and obviously isn't afraid to express them strongly. In most cases, I think it's pretty refreshing. For one, he's a really staunch defended of other writers and isn't afraid to take on everyone from Gene Roddenberry to the entire SFWA when he feels great writers aren't getting their due. A whole bunch of the classic writers we love probably would never have received a lifetime achievement award before their deaths without Ellison sticking his neck out and raising an unholy stink about it. That's admirable. He's also come out and lambasted really horrible writers like Mercedes Lackey and R.A. Salvatore who so obviously deserved it. That's pretty admirable too.

But yeah, he could probably show a lot more tact when dealing with fans. Not everyone can be Isaac Asimov I guess.