Knights & Knaves Alehouse

Calithena wrote:

T. Foster wrote:Better late than never. Shatner forgives you (though the ghost of DeForest Kelley is still muttering about you under his not-breath)

Would this be the time to admit that I've associated DeForest Kelley's face with Semaj Khan ever since I learned his real name?

Not in polite company.







...wait for it.....













Good thing we're not polite company.

While we're on the subject of Trek, can anybody here vouch for (or against) the quality of the 1970s cartoon series? I saw a couple episodes of it BITD (not its original run, when I was an infant, but when it was re-run on some cable channel (Nickelodeon?) in the 80s) but don't remember much about it other than that it had the original actors doing the voices and one of the crew was a weird-ass looking alien. Is it any good? Considering that I own season 1 on DVD, go back and forth over buying season 2 (but haven't done so yet), and have no intention of buying season 3, is the cartoon series worth buying, watching but not buying, or best avoided entirely? I know a lot of Trek fans speak very highly of it, but I don't really trust them.

T. Foster wrote:While we're on the subject of Trek, can anybody here vouch for (or against) the quality of the 1970s cartoon series? I saw a couple episodes of it BITD (not its original run, when I was an infant, but when it was re-run on some cable channel (Nickelodeon?) in the 80s) but don't remember much about it other than that it had the original actors doing the voices and one of the crew was a weird-ass looking alien. Is it any good? Considering that I own season 1 on DVD, go back and forth over buying season 2 (but haven't done so yet), and have no intention of buying season 3, is the cartoon series worth buying, watching but not buying, or best avoided entirely? I know a lot of Trek fans speak very highly of it, but I don't really trust them.

The cartoon was mediocre old school Star Trek. It wasn't particularly awful, nor was it particularly great. Some of it was hamfisted and preachy, but then it was aimed at the kids on Saturday morning...and besides, compare and contrast any of the IMPORTANT MESSAGES in the cartoon with episodes of the original show like "A Private Little War", "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" and et cetera.

I admit it. I still have a soft spot for TNG, but I dig Patrick Stewart for professional reasons. It's the same reason I still find David Lynch's Dune viewable.

Is this the right thread in which to admit that I'm really not that fond of any incarnation of Star Trek?

Do I have to turn in my geek membership card?

rogatny wrote:Is this the right thread in which to admit that I'm really not that fond of any incarnation of Star Trek?

Do I have to turn in my geek membership card?

ST (and even D&D) always gets lumped into "what they became". Sure there were nerds back then even thousands and thousands of years prior to Star Trek but what does Kirk and crew have to do with the awkward mostly aggressive douchebags known as dweebs, nerds and geeks? Was there even a nerd ever portrayed on Star Trek? That wasn't unitl TNG when it was "Nerd Trek" with the weenie kid, right? Do they find empathy with Spock because he's an alien? Is that it?

"Sorry nurse but I can't kiss you because I'm an alien."

Screw them and whatever nerd fantasy they got out of it!

KIRK!!!

KIRK!!!

Herbert, Herbert, Herbert....

Foster: "While we're on the subject of Trek, can anybody here vouch for (or against) the quality of the 1970s cartoon series?"

I loved it. Cool new races, phasers actually doing serious damage. And all the cast. The stories were also good. Grade A-

geneweigel wrote:Was there even a nerd ever portrayed on Star Trek?

Spock was a nerd. Spock was THE nerd. The prototype, if you will.

Which is why Bones was always trying to give him a wedgie.

Although, you're right about TNG. I recently saw a couple of episodes of TNG for the first time in probably 15 years. It's like they were trying to go out of their way not to have anything cool happen. Blow the aliens up? No! We're going to try to empathize with them instead!

Maybe nice diplomacy. But bad television.

Look, the first episode of TNG had 13 year old wooses piloting the Enterprise (think about the idioticness for a minute) and every time something happened Pickard surrendered, and it only got worse from there on out. Thank GOD for B-5. I think the last time I channel flipped and it was on, Pickard was kissing some chick that during his kiss turned into a dude, and all he had to say was "I found the experiance... stimulating" or something like that. Yes, hand me your agonizer Mr. Semaj.

Spock is the nerd ideal, what every nerd wanted (wants? -- he may have been eclipsed by Bill Gates) to grow up to be. Which is ironic, because to me Spock is by far the least interesting of Trek's Big 3 main characters. Kirk's moxie and decisiveness, McCoy's moral compass and bullshit-detector -- that's what makes Star Trek so good. Spock is just there as a foil for those two.

T. Foster wrote:Spock is the nerd ideal, what every nerd wanted (wants? -- he may have been eclipsed by Bill Gates) to grow up to be. Which is ironic, because to me Spock is by far the least interesting of Trek's Big 3 main characters. Kirk's moxie and decisiveness, McCoy's moral compass and bullshit-detector -- that's what makes Star Trek so good. Spock is just there as a foil for those two.

One of the best dramatic representations of the tripartate soul that I can think of.

T. Foster wrote:Spock is the nerd ideal, what every nerd wanted (wants? -- he may have been eclipsed by Bill Gates) to grow up to be. Which is ironic, because to me Spock is by far the least interesting of Trek's Big 3 main characters. Kirk's moxie and decisiveness, McCoy's moral compass and bullshit-detector -- that's what makes Star Trek so good. Spock is just there as a foil for those two.

Emphasis mine.

"Green blooded hobgoblin!"

So you're keeping ST:V then?

As for the animated series (TAS) it's entertaining & rather good considering that it was a early 70s kids cartoon. He-Man recycled parts of it which is why it may remind you of something else. TAS's noted for having quite a few good Trek or science fiction authors for writers. D. C. Fontana, David Gerrold, Larry Niven, Samuel A. Peeples, even Walter Koenig.

Alan Dean Foster adapted the epiodes in book form as Star Trek Logs. You can find the 10 volume version books cheap if you just want reading copies. There are usually two versions of each cover, I prefer the one with cel images from the show. Why? Because they flesh out the episodes and don't limit your visual imagination like TV can.

In short, TAS really feels like a continuation of TOS with a different format and budget. It's not as groundbreaking or challenging as the best of TOS but it's very entertaining.

Sidenotes:

Some of the early Trek novels and non-fiction books are rather good if sometimes period oddball. World of Trek I & II (?) even had some short stories by cast members and back then so little was developed yet some rather fun now abandoned or written over tangents were taken.

I wouldn't mind a similar show for Star Trek like the latest Clone Wars series, but then I'm a heretic in this thread.

JUST SAY NO TO MAN-SKANTS!


Man-skants are a poor substitution for the classic skimpy female uniforms!