Knights & Knaves Alehouse

Fellows,

I've exchanged some messages with Keith, and it is my opinion that his heart is in the right place, and that he is simply trying to put together a good old game of AD&D, a marathon event that should prove quite fun and interesting. I would not read any more into it than that. Also, I believe it is a Gen Con charity event, not a WotC event.

In a similar vein, I'm running an AD&D event at Dragon Con this year and have dedicated to adventure to the memory of Gary Gygax.

T. Foster wrote:Did you misread something? They're not saying people can't use the AD&D hardbacks, and on the contrary I'm sure 90+% of people participating in this will, they're just saying that if you don't have the AD&D hardbacks but want to participate anyway you can use OSRIC as a substitute for those books -- which is awesome, because that's exactly the point of OSRIC (one of the points, anyway)

Oh. Well I take back my post then. I saw it a different way.

Is this the only schedualed AD&D game going at gencon then? I was hoping after Gygax's death there'd have been interest in running full scale modules (some of the old classics).

I agree this guys heart is probably in the right place, and the plug for OSRIC is awsome.

But, what might have been better is instead of having people submitting rooms, have each person submit a mini-lair (say 4-8 rooms connected by corridors (with traps etc.), something similar to those mini-lairs they used to publish in the old Dungeon magazine) with a time limit to complete it (say 4 hours) with 12 players.

That would have been much more interesting (and something publishable and usable to anyone) and given a better taste of the game to newbies. Your not going to learn much about the game going into a single room and getting zapped. And forget about "theme" (a small crypt, a small wizards tower, a small bugbear lair, etc.) that won't make much since in this format. AD&D is more then a collection of killer monsters and traps. Its entering a place (lair, dungeon etc.), killing, and leaving with loot, or die trying and in the process working together to move ahead. Thats what you want to introduce to players.

This set up could actually give a negative impression of what AD&D is all about ("gee I played it and hated it, it seems this game is all about creative ways of killing you, it was cool but didn't leave much for us players to do") it gives a tactics puzzle heavy feel to a game that is about so much more.

Also, one of the premisses of AD&D is throwing normal ordinary run of the mill encounters/situations (often overly powerful) at players and watching them come up with their own creative responses (run, charge, throw oil, charm the leader of the attacking force, attempt to sneak past, offer a tribute etc. let the PCs create the "magic" some). The Tomb of Horrors style setting was the atypical and designed for the experianced player who was getting bored and wanted to be WOWed. Its suitable for experianced AD&Ders, but for newbies, your presenting cutesy clever death rooms that don't teach a damned thing about Gygaxian D&D. I remember a link Foster gave to a dungeon Gary ran for some ENWorld guys last year. A group of adventurers enter a dungeon and go to investigate a room, when down the corridor they hear their donky screaming, turning they see a gelatenous cube eating it before their eyes. The group were goners, but one of the players tossed a lit flask of oil at the ceiling above it (a difficult role) but pulled out a 20. Now, thats the kind of experiance you want to present. Give the PCs the ordinary, let them do the extraordinary or die trying.

AxeMental wrote:Is this the only schedualed AD&D game going at gencon then? I was hoping after Gygax's death there'd have been interest in running full scale modules (some of the old classics). <<snip>>

Actually, this isn't the only AD&D event at Gen Con. I'm running four events this year (see link following), and have run AD&D events at Gen Con Indy for the last two years. Alas, the adventures I have used and will use this year are more recent publications than the classic Gygax adventures for AD&D. But methinks that may change for future Gen Con's.

http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/phpbb/v ... highlight=

AxeMental wrote:<<snip>>
I agree this guys heart is probably in the right place, and the plug for OSRIC is awsome.

But, what might have been better is instead of having people submitting rooms, have each person submit a mini-lair (say 4-8 rooms connected by corridors (with traps etc.), something similar to those mini-lairs they used to publish in the old Dungeon magazine) with a time limit to complete it (say 4 hours) with 12 players.

That would have been much more interesting (and something publishable and usable to anyone) and given a better taste of the game to newbies. Your not going to learn much about the game going into a single room and getting zapped. And forget about "theme" (a small crypt, a small wizards tower, a small bugbear lair, etc.) that won't make much since in this format. AD&D is more then a collection of killer monsters and traps. Its entering a place (lair, dungeon etc.), killing, and leaving with loot, or die trying and in the process working together to move ahead. Thats what you want to introduce to players.

This set up could actually give a negative impression of what AD&D is all about ("gee I played it and hated it, it seems this game is all about creative ways of killing you, it was cool but didn't leave much for us players to do") it gives a tactics puzzle heavy feel to a game that is about so much more.

Also, one of the premisses of AD&D is throwing normal ordinary run of the mill encounters/situations (often overly powerful) at players and watching them come up with their own creative responses (run, charge, throw oil, charm the leader of the attacking force, attempt to sneak past, offer a tribute etc. let the PCs create the "magic" some). The Tomb of Horrors style setting was the atypical and designed for the experianced player who was getting bored and wanted to be WOWed. Its suitable for experianced AD&Ders, but for newbies, your presenting cutesy clever death rooms that don't teach a damned thing about Gygaxian D&D. I remember a link Foster gave to a dungeon Gary ran for some ENWorld guys last year. A group of adventurers enter a dungeon and go to investigate a room, when down the corridor they hear their donky screaming, turning they see a gelatenous cube eating it before their eyes. The group were goners, but one of the players tossed a lit flask of oil at the ceiling above it (a difficult role) but pulled out a 20. Now, thats the kind of experiance you want to present. Give the PCs the ordinary, let them do the extraordinary or die trying.

Yeah, doing something along these lines would be a better representation of what well run AD&D games are like than this year's Tower of Gygax.

Agreed.

Axe is correct.

The changing room format is not an ADD old school experience. It is a recipie for boedeom

I would suggest while well meaning, this guy has no idea what AD&D was or still is about.

I would rather have 5 tables going at the same time simply running shorter adventures. AS members are killed off, new people can enter the game if availabel or the deceased can re-enter with a new character.

The more I think about it, the more it will turn into a "fun for abit, but glad I play 3e or 4e becuase ADD was just goingh from room to room" bullshi+.

I thought to myself, "hey, maybe I will write up something for this, just for S&Gs, and for the thrill of knowing that people I respect from these forums may be either playing or DMing it". Then I noticed that the deadline is tomorrow so, um, nevermind.

- Wheggi

You could submit your resetting skeletons room, Wheggi---that would fit in quite nicely, I think!

AxeMental wrote:But, what might have been better is instead of having people submitting rooms, have each person submit a mini-lair (say 4-8 rooms connected by corridors (with traps etc.), something similar to those mini-lairs they used to publish in the old Dungeon magazine) with a time limit to complete it (say 4 hours) with 12 players.

Actually, the way it works, you can submit rooms that are anywhere from an interlude (15 minutes or less), to a full 2 hour mini-dungeon. A session consists of 6 players with 6 others on standby to swap in whenever someone dies. And there is encouragement to write rooms that involve the standys as well.

grodog wrote:You could submit your resetting skeletons room, Wheggi---that would fit in quite nicely, I think!

You think it would? I guess there could be a trimmed-down version of it, since ideally the treasure in this encounter is the coffin lids themselves (which, when put together in the right order, create a map to "other stuff") and that just won't work in this type of gaming environment.

Or could it?

Allen, you have all the info for this, correct? PM me with what you think needs to be done with the encounter, and we can hammer this out and get it off to the guy. Tomorrow's the deadline, so I guess I better hussle.

- Wheg

Email sent (PMs are such a hassle for back-and-forth dialogue ). If you want to contribute, and can't meet tomorrow's deadline, then you can also email Keith with a heads-up for when you'll be able to get content to him (though I'm sure sooner is better, given how close GC looms!).

If anyone here is interested, I am willing to share my contribution to this event. It is an AD&D mini-adventure called "Chasm of the Faceless Lord," and it takes about 1 or 2 hours to run. It took my group 1:45 to finish it. It is sparse on "plot" and simple in design, but might make a fun event if you are looking to DM a quick game for 6 characters that average about 4th level. Email me or PM me, and I'll send you the updated map and the adventure (in rtf).

ghul at comcast dot net

I also mis-read the deadline, which is 1 August, so the entries aren't due until tomorrow.