Knights & Knaves Alehouse

I read in one of the Warhammer novels* about a dwarven "book of grudges," and it made me think for a moment about how long I hold a grudge before it fades. It seems for me to be about two years (although there are a couple of people who are shoot-on-sight, but that's because they're dangerous and wouldn't be in my family's vicinity for any casual reason; those don't count as a grudge). Is two years a long time, short time, or about average, you figure?

*The William King Warhammer novels Trollslayer, Skavenslayer, Daemonslayer (to a lesser degree) and Beastslayer (if that's the one about the siege of Praag) are quite good and may appeal to oldschool audiences. There are a few things that are offputting, mainly because the books have to fit with the rules of a game, but in general these books are basically about two guys going into strange fantasy places and kicking ass there. A nice, rollicking read that's uncommon to find in novels published as late as 1999. The separate editions are out of print, but Amazon has an omnibus edition of the first three books, and there's a nice little map of part of the Warhammer world at the front, too.

You know of course that we would have break this down into "grudge levels" to be the most accurate and get a proper.... ah heck thats too much work.

Let's just say I have a few very long term grudges, a few short term ones that have blown over and a few that are nearing thier expiration date. I even hang on to a couple generational grudges that have been passed down through the family.

I guess I like a good grudge.

Jerry

The Dwarf language has no word for forgiveness, but many subtle variations on revenge, recompense and retribution.

- Warhammer Armies: Dwarfs



As the proud owner of a dwarf army, I can say without any reservations that grudges should be held FOR-EV-ER. I am happy to report that our own Book of Grudges is chock full of entries, and the day will come when all are accounted for.

Truth be told, in the time it will take to resolve all of our grudges an equal amount of new offenses will have been logged into the book. Therefore I am happy to say that we will NEVER run out of things to hold a grudge against. Much like Oscar the Grouch, we are never content unless we have something to complain about!

As for the Slayer books, they are a fun and simple read. Gotek and Felix make a good pair. In fact, they just came out with new minitures for these characters. I may have to pick them up . . .

- Wheggi

I don't hold grudges at all.

I dunno, I'm chronically incapable of holding a grudge. When people tick me off, often I can only hold my rage for a few days. Then I forget all about it during my next game of Super Mario World.

Too long and not long enough.

joe b.

Life I'm afraid. That doesn't mean I dwell on it, and a person can return to almost normal status if they sincerely change for the better. But yeah, someone that screwed me over 15 years ago and I haven't seen them since is still on the sh..t list.

I do not hold grudges although I used to get blind rage angry on occasion when severely provoked, but that would blow over within an hour or so and then it was done; I have not been that angry since I was a teenager, now I only get angry but have full control of my behaviour as befits an adult. I just do not have any spare time or energy to spend on holding a grudge, so I make the choice not to. YMMV

Yeah, it depends on the reason for the grudge as to how long it lasts. My wife's mother is never welcome in our home again, for very good reasons. Then there are the ones so minor that they may last only hours, days, or weeks.

I held a grudge against one of my uncles for nearly 20 years. then I was forced to interact with him and quickly realized my grudge against him was do to a teenagers inability to understand certain realities of life. So now I find he is actually a pretty cool guy and seriously regret avoiding him for almost 20 years.

Then there is my fathers current wife. The Emperess of Narcicism goes well beyond grudge. Disgust, disdain, repulsion, and out right dislike, yes. No, hate is too worthy of her. I think it is actually pretty sad to be as old as she is and still be a pathetic and useless human being.

Besides, all the kids she raised are out of therapy now and actually putting together pretty decent lives. Despite her best efforts to make them feel like worthless trash.

Lets just say if this woman is ever murdered there will not be a "short list" of suspects.

Why does my father put up with her? Here is one of her tricks, she runs you so far into debt you can't afford to divorce her without losing a lot, especially in a no fault divorce state.

I've told my dad in the long run divorcing her will be cheaper than paying off/keeping up with paying all that debt. Its so painful of a truth he hasn't been willing to accept it, yet.

So, yeah, we need definitions of Grudges and such to get really detailed results.

for the most part I forgive and forget. For those I can't I move 1700 miles away from and visit only when I absolutely have to.

A few hours, maybe a couple of days.... I don't know I just can't stay mad at people for very long. There are a few ex-posters from DF that I detest but they are less than human and deserve to be scorned as they are agents of evil

With one or two exceptions which lasted a few years, I don't hold grudges at all.

It's worth pointing out that there is a difference between forgiving and forgetting (despite the fact that these two are juxtaposed in a famous phrase). So one might forgive someone for something, but (at the same time) not forget, and act accordingly. For example, suppose you give a friend the keys to your house, and he subsequently abuses the privilege (steals from you, eats all of your food, etc.). You might forgive this particular incident but it doesn't mean that you'll ever give him the keys to your house again.

I would not call that holding a grudge. I'd call it common sense!

I try (with varying degrees of success, depending on the slight) to always allow someone to make up a wrong done to me, but until they do so, they're generally dead to me. Sometimes it can be as simple as an apology, other hurts can take more substantive recompense. Although I don't consciously act to harm them or extract vengence, I guess that still counts as a grudge. I'll hold it for however long it takes for them to come around, or for me to realize I made a mistake, if I've done so.

Now, my game characters hold mean, nasty grudges unto the death. Either party's death.

There is only one person against whom I hold a grudge, and it is probably for life. The direct harm was great enough, especially given the importance of the trust betrayed. The secondary consequences hobbled me for the whole of my young adulthood. There are tertiary consequences in being unable to undertake some things until middle age. In the best outcome, those are likely to remain significant decades hence.

It galls me to see someone enjoy the very things of which that person robbed me. Despite the envy, I can wish that person only well because the welfare of others is involved. The anger probably could be discharged in acknowledgement, repentance and forgiveness — but I don't expect that ever to happen. I work to turn the energy in positive directions.

That I cannot again regard that person with the simple, trusting, generous love that I once knew is itself a significant loss.

By contrast, I held for but a few years a grudge against a physically powerful friend who in a rage killed someone who was effectively helpless. The court's verdict was manslaughter, but in my eyes it was murder. In the long run, the man's consistent character and the bond of our friendship overcame that shocking departure. We met again as rivals for the attention of the same woman — and quickly forgot her in getting reacquainted with each other.

I was going to say that I hold a grudge for a long time ... until I forget about it ... which isn't likely if it is over something I feel is serious.

However, the times when people have acted in a such a way to make me feel bad I usually let them know there and then and retaliate in some (often equally innapropriate) manner.

There are a few grudges that I do hold because to make retribution of an equivalent level I would risk being removed from society and I genarally like my life as it is, thankyou. At the point in my life when inclusion into this society is not a smuch of an issue - beware!

If that makes me sound a bit sociopathic then so be it. I think I do plenty of nice things and help people all the time. I'm square in my opinion.



In AD&D my assassin PC doeas not hold grudges because there is no level to which he wouldn't stoop and no risk too great in returning "favours".