Knights & Knaves Alehouse

austinjimm wrote:

Falconer wrote:19% The Holiday Special

Aw, man, The Holiday Special is as awesome as it is terrible on so many levels. I dig out my bootleg VHS every November-- and every time I notice something new!!!

I definitely feel the prequels were worse than the Holiday Special. At least the Holiday Special had Bea Arthur singing and doing jazz hands while dancing with Greedo*. Nothing in the prequels is remotely that entertaining.

* - I know it can't actually be Greedo, given the timeline, but "Bea Arthur singing and doing jazz hands while dancing with a Rodian" is not as funny.

During production, the Greedo-type aliens were called Martians.

You know, in one of the more recent releases of Return of the Jedi, they added a scene at the end, of Jar Jar dancing on a rooftop on Naboo and shouting “Wesa free!” George Lucas’s final fuck you.

George Lucas had a certain part of whackness and tone-deafness always in him. If you look at what was cut from Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back...a lot of the goofy fart humour was always there*. In the prequels, nobody stopped him, though.

*The Wampa sub-plot of ESB, for example.

This thread is way better than any other TLJ thread I've read. Well done guys!

JCBoney wrote:

I am not sure what you are saying there. But if you think my emotions in that regard are cringeworthy, I can only say: I post my nerd-emotions of my inner child on a D&D Forum in a Star Wars thread. If not here, I would not know where.

If you are too cool for Star Wars, good for you.

I am not.

ADD: And it was never fashionable or cool to be a Luke Skywalker Fan. There was nothing to deconstruct there. Basically everybody who was a Skywalker Fan were innocent people who did no harm and for whom even Han Solo was too edgy. Why would somebody give them, us, the finger? Skywalker fangirls and -boys did not even exist as a category to be lampooned or that somebody said anything bad about them. They were not even annoying. No hate deserved, and for 40 years there was no hate. But suddenly Disney feels the need to hate the Luke Fans. Why?

Who said anything at all about hating Luke fans?

Settembrini wrote:

JCBoney wrote:

I am not sure what you are saying there. But if you think my emotions in that regard are cringeworthy, I can only say: I post my nerd-emotions of my inner child on a D&D Forum in a Star Wars thread. If not here, I would not know where.

If you are too cool for Star Wars, good for you.

I am not.

ADD: And it was never fashionable or cool to be a Luke Skywalker Fan. There was nothing to deconstruct there. Basically everybody who was a Skywalker Fan were innocent people who did no harm and for whom even Han Solo was too edgy. Why would somebody give them, us, the finger? Skywalker fangirls and -boys did not even exist as a category to be lampooned or that somebody said anything bad about them. They were not even annoying. No hate deserved, and for 40 years there was no hate. But suddenly Disney feels the need to hate the Luke Fans. Why?

Who me? I love Luke Skywalker. Great guy.

No, I just think you're a little over-reactive over a goddamned movie.

Still haven’t seen this fucking movie. At this rate I imagine it will be out of theaters before I get around to it.

Wheggi wrote:Still haven’t seen this fucking movie. At this rate I imagine it will be out of theaters before I get around to it.

I saw and liked the movie. But there’s no reason you won’t enjoy it just as much as you would have in the theater if you see it at home in high def with a reasonably decent sound system. It’s not a “You must see it on the big screen!” type of movie.

Settembrini wrote:I post my nerd-emotions of my inner child on a D&D Forum in a Star Wars thread. If not here, I would not know where.

Hahah, yeah, I actually agree, online is a great place to sort this shit out. So in real life if someone asks you “are you a big Star Wars guy at all or…?” you can respond with something clever and nonchalant, rather than biting his head off for asking you such a loaded question.

(I still haven’t seen the new movie, either.)

Haven't seen it. Will probably wait for Bluray or Netflix.

This is cathartic after all. After awhile, if you're so worked up and angry over something that makes you say you'll never like something like TLJ, eventually, you either stick to your guns, or you just stop being angry because it uses too much energy to continue.

Having said that, most of my demons are out there (here & DF, mainly) and all I can say is that I don't begrudge anyone for liking TLJ, but I totally get it if you don't. Like Ben said in ESB, "Its a truth from a certain point-of-view..." Or paraphrased.

I will say that the spoilers I heard (not here, K&KA was NOT the source of those spoilers!) before I was able to go see it have prevented me from seeing it. This will be the most spoilered movie I have never seen, and that has affected my judgement.

Now I have to go see it and make up my own mind. I am not hopeful. Rather, I am very dejected about it, knowing what is in store.

My reverence of Star Wars as a piece of mythology that was part of me growing up and forming into maturity a belief in healthy role models, albeit it based in mythical heroism has always given me hope in the future and my fellow man.

"I am a Jedi like my Father before me."

Will this movie inform me that my beliefs were simply pointless after all is said and done? If it does, then the movie is a lie and not worth my time and investiture from this point onward.

I would like to point out that TLJ bares some thematic similarities to ESB.

ESB:
- Luke finds out that Ben lied to him all along and that his father is, in fact, one of the most evil mofos to hit the galaxy.
- Han is captured and FedExed off to Jabba... another evil mofo.
- The Rebel Alliance is chased off its base and scattered to the winds.

TLJ:
- Rey finds out her parents were nobodies and learns this from an evil mofo.
- Luke is in a moral quandry as to the role of the Jedi and if they should even have a role anymore.
- The Rebel Alliance is scattered to the winds.

I think this will be all resolved in the last movie.

JCBoney wrote:I would like to point out that TLJ bares some thematic similarities to ESB.

ESB:
- Luke finds out that Ben lied to him all along and that his father is, in fact, one of the most evil mofos to hit the galaxy.
- Han is captured and FedExed off to Jabba... another evil mofo.
- The Rebel Alliance is chased off its base and scattered to the winds.

TLJ:
- Rey finds out her parents were nobodies and learns this from an evil mofo.
- Luke is in a moral quandry as to the role of the Jedi and if they should even have a role anymore.
- The Rebel Alliance is scattered to the winds.

I think this will be all resolved in the last movie.

The difference should be made that 30-40 years of experience after RotJ should have made Luke more wiser, not regress into the character as portrayed in TLJ. This is what Mark Hamill railed about this whole time before the movie came out. (...and possibly silenced/retraction with Mouse Money...)

bobjester wrote:The difference should be made that 30-40 years of experience after RotJ should have made Luke more wiser, not regress into the character as portrayed in TLJ. This is what Mark Hamill railed about this whole time before the movie came out. (...and possibly silenced/retraction with Mouse Money...)

But really, should he? Every single thing he's learned about the Jedi or from the Jedi turned out to be a lie or shambles.

- Ben and Yoda lied about his parentage (resulting in him kissing his sister a couple of times).
- He had to use the Dark Side in order to defeat his father, and he didn't fall in.
- His Jedi training program went to shit because of one student.

If anything, he's right where he should be... isolated from everything to which he once clinged and bitter.

This is SW grown up, where the consequences of Ben and Yoda's actions have born a bitter fruit. Once Luke defeats Vader, he has nowhere to go since that's the path for which he was groomed. I'd be bitter too.